Roadtrek

Roadtrek

Wednesday, January 16, 2013

SHORE POWER

This is the fourth article in our series on electricity in your Roadtrek and the third type of electric power that we will talk about that you have available. You are on "shore" power when your Roadtrek (or any RV) is plugged directly into a 110/120 volt outlet. This is the most unlimited source of electricity that you can have in your Roadtrek.When your Roadtrek is plugged into shore power all of your electric appliances and 110/120 volt outlets will work. When your Roadtrek is plugged into shore power, your vehicle's engine battery and your coach batteries are being charged.

The Roadtrek has a 30 amp electric circuit. Larger RVs may have a 50 amp electric circuits. The larger number of amps you have allows you to plug in and use more amp drawing appliances and electric devices. Without getting into a technical explanation, if you plugged more than 30 amps into the Roadtrek outlets you would trip the circuit breaker - either in the Roadtrek or at the external outlet - or both. When you look at the plug that your Roadtrek has connected to its power cord outside, you will see a large plug with three prongs - and those prongs are larger and look different from a usual house electric cord. (Just for your understanding, if you looked at a 50 amp plug you would see four prongs on a much larger plug.)

When you go to a campground and look in the electric box on the power pedestal at your campsite you will usually see three outlets. One will be a very large outlet with four holes. This is the 50 amp outlet. One will be large and have three holes. This is the 30 amp outlet. One will look exactly like the outlets that you have in your house. This is the 20 amp outlet. When you take your Roadtrek cord out of its storage cabinet outside the van and plug it in, you are going to use that mid-sized large outlet with the large three holes. Each of the outlets in the box will also have a circuit breaker above it or below it. At one campground we went to, instead of circuit breaker switches there were glass fuses. You may be at a campsite that has only 30 amp/20 amp service - in this case you will only see two outlets in the box, the 30 amp outlet and the 20 amp outlet and no four hole fifty amp outlet.

Before plugging your Roadtrek cord plug into the outlet make sure all of those circuit breakers in the campground electric box are OFF. Plug in your Roadtrek cord and THEN turn the circuit breaker for that outlet ON. Before you unplug, turn the breaker OFF and then pull the plug. The reason for this should be obvious. If the circuit breaker is OFF then there is no power and no danger of shock from that outlet when you plug in.

You are going to ignore the 50 amp outlet and the 20 amp outlet. You don't need those. There are some circumstances when you may need to use one of those but we will talk about that later. For now, not to complicate things - you need 30 amps so use the 30 amp outlet.

Before I plug into any campground outlet I do two tests of the campground outlet. I test the polarity of the outlet and the number of volts that the outlet is putting out. The reason that I do this is because sometimes a campground electric box is old, has been damaged, or has a wire come loose and the polarity (shows all wires have been connected where they should be) may be wrong. I also want to be sure that the outlet is not under voltage or over voltage - both of which can damage the electric system in your Roadtrek (or any RV) if you plug into it. To do these tests you need a polarity tester and a volt meter. Both are not hard to find - the polarity tester is the easiest to find. Any electric/lighting department in a home store or even Walmart will have a polarity tester for a few dollars. This looks just like a home plug with no wire but with three lights on top and a little chart right on the top of the plug. You plug this in and look at the lights that light. Match the lights to the pattern that shows "GOOD" on the chart and you are fine. A voltage meter is a little more difficult to find and are a bit more expensive. The easy find for this is a device called a "Kill-A-Watt" which is a multi-use tester also sold in home stores that will not only measure and tell you how many volts are on an outlet but also will measure the number of amps and watts used by an appliance plugged into this device and then this plugged into an outlet. For your RV you mainly want the volt meter function that this device has built in. You plug the meter into the outlet and push the proper button for a voltage reading and you will see the voltage that the outlet is putting out digitally on the screen.  The reading should be no lower than 110 and no higher than 132 - though you really do not want to be over 130. These two testers are made for 110/120 volt - 15/20 amp outlets and you want to test a 30 amp outlet. You simply buy a 30 amp plug to 15/20 amp outlet adapter. This is a thick wire - like your Roadtrek power cord with a household three prong socket on one end and a 30 amp large round plug just like your Roadtrek power cord has on the other end. With the campground power box circuit breaker off, tester into the socket end of the adapter and then plug the adapter plug into the 30 amp outlet in the power box. Now turn on the circuit breaker in the power box and take your reading. Turn off the circuit breaker, unplug the first tester and then plug in the second - turn on the circuit breaker and take your reading. Turn off the circuit breaker. Unplug the adapter from the power box and put your adapter and testers away.

What do you do if any of your readings on your tests are NO GOOD? The best thing to do is go to the campground office and let them know and request another site. If they do not have another site then be sure that they have a maintenance person come to your power box to fix the problem. 

You could just plug your Roadtrek power cord plug into the box, but it is a good idea to have something in your electric line that will protect your RV just in case. What you need is an RV power protection device. There are two popular makes - Surge Guard and Progressive. Both do the same job. Some prefer one over the other. There are models that can be wired permanently into your RV electric system and there are portable models that simply plug into the campground outlet and you plug your power cord into the protector outlet. These are not cheap and they are much, much more than a surge protector like what you plug your computer into at home. You can purchase these directly from the companies that make them or you can find them at RV supply stores. We chose the Surge Guard but only for convenience in ordering as it is the one that is sold at Camping World.


Above you see the Surge Guard plugged into the power outlet of the campground and the power cord of my Roadtrek. You also see that the electric box has your space number on it. You cannot mistake which box is the one you are supposed to plug into. At some campgrounds your box will be next to the box for the next space. Here there is only one box.

 The power protector unit is going to monitor the voltage coming out of the box. Believe it or not, just because it tested correctly when you checked with your volt meter does not mean that conditions do not change in the voltage at the campground over time and the voltage go too low or too high. Also it will protect from spikes and surges due to lighting strikes. This is a must have. Repairing your RVs electric system and replacing your TV and electronics is far more expensive than the $300 plus that one of these sells for. You can buy a lock box that will prevent the theft of your portable power unit. Watch this video about the Surge Guard Power Protector.

Now before you plug your surge/power protector in or your Roadtrek power cord in, go inside your Roadtrek and turn on your battery switch. There is a large sticker on the wall of my Roadtrek that tells me to do this - and that is why I do.






 Now - plug in your Roadtrek power plug into the surge/power protector and then plug the surge/power protector into the campground pedestal. Turn on the campground power outlet's circuit breaker and you are almost good to go. The surge/power protector has a delay of about three minutes. You will see the power light come on but you will not have power inside your Roadtrek until you hear a click and an LED comes on to say all circuits are good and power is now flowing. Sometimes these will seem like very long three minutes.

When you go inside your Roadtrek you now have 110/120 volt power in all of the electric outlets. You will see the display panel on your microwave has come on. Your air conditioner can now be turned on. You can watch TV. You can plug whatever you like into the outlets. You can even turn on the microwave while the air conditioner is running. You have plenty of power.

Worth repeating - While you are plugged into shore power your coach batteries and your van battery is being charged. This is a secondary benefit to shore power.

I had talked above about the other two outlets in the campground power box. If you found that the 30 amp outlet had a problem - and you cannot be moved to another space or no one is coming to fix it, with a 50 amp to 30 amp adapter - another plug adapter - you could plug your 30 amp Roadtrek into the 50 amp outlet - and because of how the adapter is made, you will only be taking 30 amps from that outlet. If you were to do this - test the 50 amp outlet using both adapters to plug your testers in. The using the 50 amp adapter you can plug in your Roadtrek or you can plug in your 30 amp surge/power protector into the 50 amp outlet (again with the adapter) and then plug your Roadtrek into that. Again, with the adapter you are only taking 30 amps into your Roadtrek.

That 15/20 amp house-type outlet in the power box can be used if you want to plug a regular household cord connected to lights, radio, or whatever while you are outside. This is just like your outlets at home.

With everything that I have told you here, you are ready to plug your Roadtrek into a campground electric outlet, but what if you are at home and want to plug your Roadtrek in? No problem. I do this all of the time.

Rarely will you have a 30 amp outlet at home, but you have outdoor outlets that are either 15 amps or 20 amps. You can plug your Roadtrek into one of these - as long as you understand certain things and also have a special adapter and a special extension cord (if your Roadtrek cord does not reach on its own). Let's talk about plugging in first.

At home you don't need to do all of the tests. It is your home outlet and hopefully it is wired correctly. If in doubt - do the tests. I also always use the surge/power protector even at home.  You do need another type of 15 amp to 30 amp adapter. This is very much like the other adapter described above except that it has a 15 amp plug and a 30 amp socket. (All of these adapters can be purchased at an RV store and also at Walmart in the RV section of the auto department.) So you plug your adapter into your outside house outlet and plug your Roadtrek power cord into that - following the exact same steps as above - battery switch on, etc. Don't worry here about the circuit breaker being on - this is just like plugging anything else in at home. If your power cord for your Roadtrek does not reach you should not use a household extension cord - even a heavy-duty one. These are too low a gauge of wire and will get hot and can catch fire. You want an RV 30 amp extension cord. The thickness of the wire of this cord will match your Roadtrek power cord and it will have a 30 amp plug and socket. These cost about $50 at Walmart - again in the RV section, and this is worth the price of not setting your house, etc. on fire.

You need to understand that you only have up to half of the amps that your Roadtrek is designed for. This is only a problem if you turn on electrical devices in your Roadtrek that exceed a total of what you have at the outlet - either 15 amps or 20 amps. I have 20 amps at my outside outlet and nothing else is connected to the circuit that this outlet is on. That means that I have 20 amps to use in my Roadtrek. With that I can run the air conditioner, the TV, a laptop, the lights, but not much more. There is no way that I could turn on the microwave with the air conditioner running. If I did I would trip the circuit breaker for that outlet inside my house. I would have overloaded the circuit - which can be dangerous if the circuit breaker did not do its job and shut off power instantly on the overload. Not all outside outlets are on a circuit in your home circuit breaker panel by themselves. Some share other circuits in your house. If it does, then you must subtract those amps on that other outlet(s) from what you have available to your Roadtrek. This means you can turn on or plug in even less inside your Roadtrek. Just be aware. If you visit friends and are going to plug into their outside outlet while you stay on their driveway, you may be tripping their circuit breaker if you are not aware of how many amps you have to use. How do you decide this? Ask what else in the house is on that circuit breaker and if there is another room or whatever, then figure that you have little to use in the Roadtrek. You may be able to use everything but the microwave or the air conditioner (never both). Be conservative in what you turn on or plug in. 

I often plug in at home when I want to charge my coach batteries. Just about any outlet from your house will handle this without a problem. You will need a 30 amp to 15 amp adapter which are available where RV accessories are sold including Walmart. Be aware that if there are any other outlets on the circuit breaker in your house that is connected to the outlet you are plugging your Roadtrek in, anything plugged into other outlets on that circuit breaker reduces the number of amps available to the outlet you have your Roadtrek plugged into. So a 15 amp or a 20 amp outlet at your house MAY NOT be providing a full 15 amps or 20 amps to the outlet you are plugging your Roadtrek into.


I have tried to keep this simple and how to. Everything electric uses amps. The total amps you can use is limited to either your 30 amp limit in the Roadtrek or the amp limit of your power source - which is up to and no more than 30 amps but with a household outlet may be much less than 30.


When plugged into a 30 amp shore power outlet at a campground you have the full capacity of the electric system in your Roadtrek.

24 comments:

  1. I just acquired a 1998 190-Versatile on Dodge chassis. The owners manual doesn't say anything about switching on the battery disconnect prior to connecting to shore power. Should I assume that it should be on? Wouldn't that facilitate charging the cabin battery?

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. At some point Roadtrek started putting stickers inside next to the battery switch that says Turn on Battery before connecting to external power. This may have come with the change from the older model's separate inverter and then a converter/charger and the newer models' TrippLite 3-way inverter/converter/charger. It cannot hurt to put the battery switch on - essentially what you are doing then is putting on the 12 volt system. While connected to shore power you will be charging the batteries at the same time so you are taking out 12 volt power for the lights, water pump, etc. and putting a charge back into the coach battery at the same time.

      Delete
  2. We have a 2008 Roadtrek 210P which we bought used July 2011. It always seemed that the house batteries did not charge when plugged in to shore power. Then, this last weekend we went camping and noticed that the battery charge indicator went from "G" to "F" and finally to "L" while we were plugged in to shore power (coffee maker and microwave all worked). Also, the lights on the fridge went off although it was set to "AC" when battery charge went to "L". What do you think is happening?
    Thanks in advance and we love your blog!

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. In a 2008 210 you have a TrippLite 750w inverter/converter/charger that manages all of the electricity in your Roadtrek. The same unit charges your batteries, inverts 12 v to 110 v and also converts 110v to 12 v. I would start looking there for the problem. First - I assume that your battery switch was set to ON when you were plugged in - it should be. Look at the actual inverter unit - not the switch on the wall. There will be a slide switch on the front - right labeled "Charge Only", left labeled "Auto/Remote" and the middle position is OFF. Make sure it is set to the left - Auto/Remote. There is a photo of the inverter in my article that on the index page is listed as "Locating the Inverter". Your inverter may not be located in the same place - likely it is not, but the inverter unit is the same and you will see this switch in the last photo. Also look at my Inverter article and there is a link there to the manual which will explain the LEDs on the unit. You can troubleshoot the unit with the LEDs. Make sure it is actually light up correctly once you see that the switch is where it belongs. When plugged in, it is the inverter unit that sends the charge to both your coach battery(ies) and your engine battery. The other possibility is that your coach battery(ies) is bad and needs replacement. From 2008 until now that is possible. Have you been checking the fluid levels in the batteries regularly. If that fluid is low, it will not give power and will not charge. Any service station (car) can check the electrolyte in the battery and see if the cells inside are good. This will tell you immediately if the battery needs to be replaced. Remember you must replace with a deep cycle RV/Marine battery - either wet cell or AGM. (AGM requires a change of dip switch on the inverter unit.) - you can't use a regular vehicle starting battery. Let me know what happens!

      Delete
  3. Thanks for your prompt response. I have done some checking: The battery fluid levels are fine (the batteries are less than a year old). As for the inverter when the generator is on and the inverter is in "Auto/Remote", the "Batt Voltage" red LED is on and the "Line" yellow LED is on. In "Charge Only" mode, there are no LEDs lit. When the generator is off the situation is the same.
    We're this weekend we're travelling and will be staying at a campground with shore power. I'll check the inverter then.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. The last thing left to try would be to "reset" the inverter - a simple process which is described in the Tripp Lite manual.

      Beyond that, this is definitely something a service tech is going to have to troubleshoot. You will be able to get by with shore power but if the battery is not charging this has to be corrected. A dead battery will result in not being able to start the generator and you will have no coach lighting, propane detector, or CO detector unless plugged in.

      Delete
  4. I just bought a 2015 roadtrek 190, how long can you keep it pluged in to shore power, just wondering. Thak you for any information. Mike.

    e-mail michaelg6907@gmail.com

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Theoretically, indefinitely. The inverter/converter/charger will monitor the battery state and pause charging when the batteries are at max capacity, and the AGM batteries have no fluid to keep checking and should not be damaged. I have heard of some that just leave it plugged in. I am not sure that I would. Unless you have a need to have 110/120 volt power on inside all of the time, plug it in when you need to be plugged in.

      Delete
  5. i have just bought a 2012 advenurous and have lost ac - no matter if shore power
    generator or battery power
    inverter reset and leds look good
    thanks for the help

    ReplyDelete
  6. Email us through the contact link and we can talk this through to try to figure out what is happening. Or contact Roadtrek customer service to speak with a factory technician. You don't mention checking circuit breakers. All 110 volt AC are on circuit breakers.

    ReplyDelete
  7. Hi! I don't have a roadtrek, but a Winnabego rialta my coach battery is being drained and I can't figure out why, so I until I can get it checked: how long do I need to plug in the shoreline to get a good charge?

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. This depends on how fast the converter/charger in your Winnabego charges the batteries. In the Roadtrek with the TrippLite 750, if the batteries drain to dead or below half charge it can can anywhere from 24 to 48 hours to charge them back to full. It takes longer to charge RV batteries back to full charge if they have drained past half charge - and draining that low also decreases the number of charge cycles the battery has in its life. As to why the battery is draining - make sure you are not leaving your battery switch on if you are not using the RV. That is only one possibility but it is common to forget to turn off the battery switch after a trip and the RV is just sitting parked for a period of time.

      Delete
  8. Hi my 2800 when using the remote switch in the coach will start the gen however it will not turn off I have replaced the switch checked all wireing to no avail the switch on the gen itself works fine can you help thanks

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Contact me through the email contact in the left column so we can talk about this. What happens if you go under the van to the Onan, open the access door, and start it with the toggle switch that is in the front on the left - and then turn that off? Contact me by email with that!

      Delete
  9. Hi,
    I recently bought a 1996 Roadtrek 190 Versatile (Dodge). I had to replace the chassis battery shortly after purchasing it. Yesterday that new battery was totally dead. My battery charger won't recharge it (doesn't seem to recognize the dead battery). Anyhow, any idea what could be draining the chassis battery and any idea how to recharge it? Many thanks.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. I have very little knowledge of a 96 Dodge based Roadtrek. The only connection with the chassis battery is a system that lets the chassis battery's alternator charge the coach batteries while you are driving. To prevent one side from draining the other side there is a battery isolator which has both the coach and the chassis battery connected to it that keeps the batteries apart and connects them when needed. The location varies - it may be inside or it may be under the hood. There is a Facebook Group for Vintage Roadtreks. There you will find others with older RTs - including 1996 190's who will be able to provide a lot more information to you on 1996 RTs than I can. All our best!

      Delete
  10. I just bought a 2001 Roadtrek with a Dodge ram engine. I've been plugged into shore at my daughters for a week and the last couple of days my engine battery has been dead. What am I doing wrong?

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. The 2001 ROadtrek has s isolator in the engine compartment which will allow the engine to charge the Roadtrek battery WHEN driving BUT the isolator is a one way unit -it does not charge the engine battery when the Roadtrek is plugged in or the generator (if you have one) is running. Also in the 2001 Roadtrek if plugged in to shore power and you want your Roadtrek battery to charge you must have the battery switch on. Later year Roadtreks have a battery separator instead of a battery isolator as yours has and with the separator - it is bi-directional - and does charge the engine battery when the Roadtrek is plugged in. What should not happen is that the engine battery should just not die while plugged in. This may mean the isolator has gone bad - since part of its job is to keep the two battery systems apart to prevent one side from draining the other side. The isolator is installed by Roadtrek - it is not part of the Dodge. A mechanic should be able to test the isolator to see if it is working correctly. Here is something to "play" with - it is a Roadtrek Electrical Simulator. Pick your model and year from the drop down menu on the left column and then click on an doff all the electrical switches that duplicate the Roadtrek - you will see on the screen what happens when each is on or off and in combinations - http://www.metrotrekkers.org/utility/electrical.htm

      Delete

  11. roadtrek 200 Popular 2001 gm, interior switch does not work to start the Onan 2800 generator, but works on the generator switch, so have you solution I have checked braker and fuses and everything is normal Tanks Rejean

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. If the switch on the generator starts it but the switch on the wall does not this would be a problem with the switch on the wall. Either the switch has gone bad or the wiring from the switch to the generator has become disconnected. When you get it started with the switch on the generator - does the meter work that is with the switch on the wall? If it does not the problem is most likely with the wiring. IF it does the switch is likely bad. I am not aware of how to trace the wiring ffrom the switch to the generator but I do know that Onan sells the switch and meter panel. If you plan to repair this yourself make sure that the part is for the correct Onan model. I know that the Onan model has changed twice since my 2012 so it is possible that there may have been other changes since 2001. If you call or email Cummins-Onan let them know that it is in a 2001 Roadtrek and was installed when the Roadtrek was new. Do the same if you take this to a shop - as they will need to know the model of the 2001 IF that will make a difference which switch to replace. I know that in the model that came out in 2012/2013 from Onan, the KY model - they added a priming function to the switch which will not work with the previous KV model. I do not know if the switch from one is interchangeable with a switch for an older model.

      Delete
  12. I am under the understanding that I should have power to all my appliances in my 2005 roadtrek 210 when inverter/ charger is on auto remote setting and I'm not hooked up to shore power, yet microwave has no power on this setting and only some sockets have power. I am new to this roadtrek. Everything works on shore and generator power and have new battery. Also, when I am in a parking lot and off hiking for a day, what setting should I use to power the refrigerator. Should I keep on auto but turn on propane or charge only? Don't know if refrigerator just on dc will last or will actually keep food cold. Thanks

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. The inverter is only connected to about four outlets. The microwave is not one of them. 2005 is the first year that Roadtrek used the TrippLite - prior an inverter was a separate unit from the converter charger and the model used in 2005 has less wattage than the later 750 that starts late 2006 and beyond. BUT Roadtrek never connected more than four outlets to the inverter - due to its limited wattage (even 750 is not enough) The usual outlets are the one over the sink, one the TV and home entertainment unit are plugged into, and two more which varied. You can only run the microwave on shore power or the generator. Which is exactly why all works on shore power but does not work on the inverter. Be aware also that the generator has 2800 watts - so you can run the A/C or you can run the microwave, but run both together and you are going to overload the generator and it will shut down tripping the breaker INSIDE the generator. As to your fridge when you are parked an out of the Roadtrek. The best way to set it is to use propane. The fridge will drain the battery faster than it will use the propane. Also turn on the battery switch as the fridge needs the battery to ignite the propane and needs that to be left on. Just don't set the fridge to DC as its main power source. PLEASE don't drive with the propane turned on - there are many things that make that dangerous including the pilot light blowing out as you drive and propane flowing out of the back of the fridge. The batteries charge while you drive - no matter what setting the TrippLite is on. Charging by the van engine battery through the alternator is independent of the TrippLite. It is done through the battery isolator that RT installed in the engine compartment and connected the engine battery and the coach batteries to directly. If you put the TrippLite on Charge Only - that disables the inverter function. The inverter outlets will not have power through the inverter from the coach batteries. What the TrippLite will do is Charge Only is charge the coach batteries when you are plugged in or running the generator. Later year Roadtreks that have the TrippLite 750 have a switch on the wall to turn the inverter on and off. When the TrippLite is set to Auto/Remote, that switch enables the switch on the wall to function and when on, puts power into those outlets connected to the inverter from the batteries. The DC Off setting disconnects the batteries from the TrippLite. When in that position - no TrippLite functions work - no inverter/no charge when on shore power or generator. BUT since engine charging is not part of the TrippLite your coach batteries will still charge when you drive. If you would like to interact more on this - please contact us through the email/contact list and we can have a direct dialog. We are always happy to help.

      Delete
  13. As with your other posts, this is SO helpful. I am learning so much! Thank you! Question: I have a long stretch to get from where I park to the best outlet for charging. I'd like to avoid the 50' 30amp RV extension cord because it is so heavy for me, and it's probably longer than I need for most campgrounds. I am thinking two 25's would be better for me....carrying one 25' for travel, and using both together for at home charging...but is there any risk or decrease in charging capability associated with piggybacking like that? Thanks in advance! ~ Bonnie

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. There is no difference between using one 30 amp RV extension cord of 50 feet from using two RV extension cords of 25 feet connected end to end and then to your shore power cord. BUT the longer the extension cord and power cord combined there is a decrease in the power that will come from the combination. Add this to a home outlet that is only 15 or 20 amps (this determined by what the circuit breaker in your breaker box in your house has on it for that outlet outside), I would not use this combination for anything more than charging. When inside the Roadtrek, don't try to turn on the A/C or run the microwave - the two most electricity consuming appliances in the Roadtrek. You should have no problem with using anything that uses the 12 volt Roadtrek battery system while plugged in at home. We have not found a campground outlet that is too far for the Roadtrek power cord to reach. It is possible - and there was one that I was not sure about - so we carried the extension cord but found we did not need it. We once had to get the Roadtrek to the service department at the dealer the night before and stay in it overnight so that first thing the next morning they could start working on it - and we did bring the extension cord the (25 feet) because of where their 30 amp outlet to plug into outside the building was located. One thing with the Roadtrek is the sites at campgrounds are made for large Class A RVs - so there is a lot of room to move the Roadtrek around the site to reach the hookups.

      Delete